Face-to-Face Insurance Sales with Steven Wiatrek

Steven: Well, I'm glad I invited me.

Ben: Sorry, were you saying something? I think there might be a delay. ⁓ yeah, of course. ⁓ the one thing I I would point out, just sort of as as housekeeping, is that when you, you know, change devices or if you change screens, often the recording breaks. So I'm just hoping that it looks like it's live on your end as well, and we shouldn't have any issues. But we did have to re-record one episode because of that. ⁓ so okay, awesome. So thanks for joining the the podcast. I noticed I've been in insurance for about

Steven: I'm glad you invited me.

Ben: ten years and I noticed that the the one area where that's still that that still sees the most insurance in the US are independent agents. And so I started this podcast really to learn more about that world and to talk to independent agents like yourself. So maybe to kick it kick it off if you wouldn't mind introducing yourself.

Steven: ⁓ my name is Stephen Biatrick. I am a 16-year veteran of the insurance industry. I ⁓ started out fresh out of college in 2010 for a call center, so I'm a little unique on that side. I worked in a call center for a life insurance company. I spent four years doing that, ⁓ got married, wanted to buy a home, so I thought I'd go into sales because the peak of the oil boom out here started in South Texas. And I was told I was not salesman material. So by chance, I ended up meeting a gentleman who became my mentor at a captive insurance company, and I'm gonna leave their name out of it. but they found me and they basically offered me a desk. So I got my licensing, joined, spent the next ten and a half years building a $4.5 million book of business, managing about a thousand clients by myself. What led to me leaving leaving to going to the independent world was, you know, 2020 hit, ⁓ the world shut down to COVID. And what I noticed is I am a very hyper servant leader salesman. I do everything face to face with my clientele. The world never came back the same. So suddenly meeting my quota requirements for my previous company got harder and harder. In two thousand twenty-four In July, I was approached by our district sales manager and said, Hey look man, you're not beating numbers. So you're not longer relevant. So you either gonna make it happen or we don't need you anymore. So I basically went all in, I basically made a special trip from my family vacation, drove three hours around trip to make a meeting, got back and was like, Okay, well you have till November to make it work or else. Fine. Well, ⁓ November came around, won all kinds of contests, but due to underwriting and out of our control, I missed my deadline. I was given a choice to leave voluntarily, which I did, and ⁓ my last day was on December twenty third, so they let me go on Christmas Eve, basically Christmas Eve. And yeah, I went f ⁓ you know, I thought I was gonna retire there. I sp you know, almost eleven years. I was like, Man, this is I'm gonna build the company, I'm gonna do well.

Ben: Ouch.

Steven: And I went from that four point five million dollar book to a zero income at Christmas on the twenty-four. the firm I'm with now, City Center, ⁓ which is insurance distribution company, found me in late January and said, Hey look, we're expanding, we're going national We would like for you to come on as a branch owner within our organization. ⁓ what do you say? So I basically took a long talk with my wife, prayed on it, and I decided, well I go back into the captive world where I don't own my future, I don't own my business, and let's gamble on myself. So I started over in two thousand twenty-five from zero and I say zero, there's zero money marketing, zero money I like started at ground zero, and I built my agency over the last year. a half from that. And I'm, you know, in what everything's face to face. ⁓ I basically have grown over 200 clients just by handshaking a smile.

Ben: So what would you say is the focus of city centre insurance now?

Steven: Well, it's A unique hybrid. So you know you have your aggravators, you have your true independents, and you have your captives. Well as a distribution firm we count as one agency. ⁓ it's a little loophole in the game. So basically right now there are sixty-five branches throughout the United States and we count as one office. So it helps us get better appointments. So I have access to over sixty PNC carriers, not counting your wholesalers like Burner Wheelcox, Holster, and those guys. And I have another access to over 200 ⁓ life and health guys and annuities. So being that we can count as one, we don't have to deal with the quota requirements. So basically we negotiate the best rates with the carriers to provide for us. And I don't have some corporation on my breeding down my neck, hey ⁓ you you need to push more of this product this month. It's basically sets you up, train you, get you up to speed, get you the best resources and good luck. And it's been it's been good.

Ben: way I've heard this model work is you take a cut of the commission and then some of that goes to, you know, city centre.

Steven: So yes, it's a basic s yes, sir. So it's a split like your SIAA or your goose heads or your Brightway. basically I I have a split and I give a small per a percentile of it to them. But in turn, you know, I get you know I get a still I have a software agency fee, but with my agency fee, I get software. I got we have an exclusive contract with Easy Links, so we get an amazing radar, we have all this retention, they have virtual assistants built in. There's so many extras things that make it worth it. You know, when I took this journey, I thought about doing true independent. And I feel like, and you probably feel the same way, AI is becoming a very touchy subject in the industry. ⁓ AI, a lot of agents are saying, ⁓ well, P and C's gonna be gone, it's gonna be all AI ran. I disagree. I think AI is a double-edged sword. And I think the true winners in the next five to ten years are gonna be the agents you can adapt to AI, use as a tool to enhance my idea of servant leader and to basically serve the clients the best way you can. I'm gonna make a prediction that in the next ten years being a human independent agent or a human agent is going to be a luxury f ⁓ flex for s ⁓ clients.

Ben: How have you used AI in your day to day?

Steven: So my virtual assistant, I'm a one-man show. ⁓ so basically I spend most of my time prospecting, doing quotes, ⁓ networking. ⁓ everything I do is based off referral. ⁓ AI also helps me my retention. So every morning I have a list of all my policies coming up for the next 60 days. It's gonna show me which ones had the highest percent rate-ups, and it's automatically going to run a quotes on the background. giving me if there's still the best price or if there's a better option. Now easy links comes and goes, it has its you know flaws and it's not going to be always accurate rate, but it gives me a good starting point to check out and say, okay, this one is significantly more than what this one's showing. Let's go look here and go from there. And then of course AI also helps me with my campaigns on ⁓ hey thank you for reaching out to me. ⁓ I like to do post quite often talking to other agents and 'cause I've basically took enough writing to share my story with other agents and help train the next generation. So AI helps me do my nuggets of knowledge every day to different and agents who need assistance and just keep in touch with my clients better.

Ben: What are the AI tools that you really like using?

Steven: Excuse me?

Ben: What are the AI tools that you really like using?

Steven: I basically I'm I'm not very tech savvy. So whatever Easy Links has or chat has, I'm that's it.

Ben: Yeah. That's very interesting. can you walk me through like a regular day for Steven? Like what what what's the what are the first few things that you do when you wake up and start your start about your day?

Steven: Okay, well first thing I honest to God do every morning is I'm addicted to work. So I'm gonna wake up about five forty-five, six o'clock. Before the kiddos wake up, I will have my laptop out because I take that thing everywhere. And I'm going to check my daily emails. ⁓ if there's anything pressing, I will respond on the spot. If not, I help the kid ⁓ my wife get the kids ready for school. Once I get all my kiddos dropped off, I start my day here at the office. We'll run retention, ⁓ check any changes that need come through, any hey, you need to make a payment kind of deal and get that caught up. And I basically will spend the first half of the day quoting. Second half of the day I like to ⁓ prospect. ⁓ so basically for PNC wise, believe it or not, the pet store or the grocery store is my best ⁓ lead lead source. ⁓ I teach one method to other agents I work with, I call it the pickle method. And what I'd like to do is I'd like to go to the grocery store and play stupid. I will go to her, I'll be on the phone, hey, talking to myself, making something that my wife's on the other end. Can you ⁓ what is it you want? ⁓ you wanted to deal with pickles. And I'll walk up and down the aisle, pretend I can't find the ⁓ pickles, and I'll find someone in that aisle who looks like they'll be a good candidate for, you know, quote, bundle dip. And I'll ask him, hey, ⁓ have you seen blah blah brand of pickles? I swear, if it was a snake, it would have bit me. And they, ⁓ yeah, sure, sure, it's right here. ⁓ great. I appreciate you. Thank you so much. ⁓ if I can ever return the kindness, ⁓ let me help you with your insurance. Here's my card. And I always give three cards. ⁓ Psychology on that is I've learned people feel that you are desperate when you give three. So they're more prone to keep one. Because if you let's be honest, you give somebody one card, they're gonna throw it away, they're gonna take it home. So I do stuff like that. ⁓ business wise, I will pop in with ⁓ soda waters or cookies or something, and I'll make friends with the secretaries and ⁓ by the way, ⁓ remind me who's in charge of your ⁓ I forgot I met with him the other day. ⁓ that's Johnny. Do you mind if I go pop in the back and see him real quick? And ⁓ yeah, sure. And I'll get by and I'll say, Hey, ⁓ Rosie up front is front counter thought we'd be a great fit. ⁓ we got time to schedule meeting next week. And I basically will make my appointments that way by playing the secretary.

Ben: Yeah. Sorry, I lost you there. Where are you? ⁓ okay. That's how how many of your existing relationships have you won by meeting them through the through the method you just outlined in real life? That's so interesting.

Steven: So basically like I said, I've been doing this I've I've been in industry for sixteen years, a salesman for twelve. I've been doing this since day one. ⁓ of my current book of business, I'd say maybe 30% I've met that way. ⁓ I'm very I'm very hands-on. So I live in a small rural community in South Texas, a town of two thousand people, you know, there's one light town.

Ben: Wow.

Steven: I've been serving as the pro tem mayor and councilman for over 10 years. I helped run the local Knights of Columbus as a surnight, and I do most of my networking through the church in the city. And when you serve the community as a genuine person, people are gonna come find you for advice. You know, my wife hates it we go to Sunday Mass because I'll go to later mass and she's like, we can't get to the car after mass because everybody wants to talk to you about their questions, their problems. And it's just like, sweetheart, you're doing the Lord's work, you know, you're helping families. And you know, for me, nobody wakes up wanting to be an insurance agent when they grow up as a kid. You know, it just sort of happens. And when you meet that first client that you have to deliver that check to, it becomes real. And it just makes me very passionate that when I can help a family or a person. And I see the results of that work, it it just goes a long way.

Ben: What are the types of insurance that are mostly featured in your book?

Steven: Most right now, currently, as I started over, right now it's mostly home and auto. before when I was a captive, my niche was farm and ranch. You know, by trait, my family, we've been farmers and ranchers for four generations. ⁓ I ranch and ha as a hobby these days. So I don't get to do as much of it as I'd like to. ⁓ right now it's home auto, ⁓ some life. I've been dabbling with group health. And I'm working my way into commercial. It's just hard because I do everything face to face. So I live an hour and ten minutes in a rural city. So I literally need a plan my day around going to town to prospect. So

Ben: Really interesting. do you have a feel for what is the biggest thing that changed since you entered the insurance space?

Steven: The industry as a whole, how it's changed. ⁓ I'd like to say there's a silent extinction going on in the industry. You know, when I started, of course that was so long ago, all the greats were still there. All the old school salesmen who believed in, you know, face to face salesmanship, they were still into business. I see there's a massive we're getting to the age age where everybody's retiring or they're leaving the industry.

Ben: Yeah.

Steven: And here right now in the States, or at least in Texas, one in ten make it to year two. So I feel like there's not much younger generation coming into industry who are learning true salesmanship and you know a good bedside manner with clients. And I just I feel like the automation and AI is great, but we're streamlining our direct appointment and direct selling too much. I I just feel like there's a loss of a personal touch.

Ben: And where do you think that the unique value that a broker provides comes in?

Steven: For me as a well I'm not technically I'm not a branch owner, but City Center itself would be the broker. but the advantage is before as a captive I had one company or one choice. So it was like you want vanilla or you want vanilla?

Ben: Yeah.

Steven: And you know, I always had to tell clients, hey look, ⁓ this is the best best spot in town. There's nowhere you're gonna go. You know, I know that's not true. we had the quotas. So I hate to say this, but I did do pressure sales. I did push policies on people that I know darn well could not afford that to make sure I could support for my family. Now as an independent agent, I get to shop the board. You know, the average quote's gonna take me an hour to two hours because I'm gonna shop everybody, you know. I can give you the best policy, best price, the best claims experience possible, I'm gonna sit down and do a full-blown review and make sure I understand exactly what you want. You know, it's not like, ⁓ you need this car. Now it's like what design do you want? Do you want l you know, I can do good, cheap, and fast. You can't have all three. What do want? You know? And there's nobody controlling me anymore. I get to do it my way.

Ben: And when you say you get to do it your way, is or let me ask this in a different way. You you just outlined the types of insurance that you like to write the most, which is homeowners and auto. If someone called you to write now and they said, Stephen, I really need a homeowners quote, what would be the actual next steps that you would do after that inquiry comes in?

Steven: So the minute someone reaches out to me first, I thank them for calling. I ask them who referred them, because I like to know, because I always will call that person if I have them as a client and thank them for thinking of me and sharing me. But my standard operating procedure is for anybody, I don't care if it's a home, auto, a boat policy, or business policy, I want your declarations page because I want to see what you have. You know, not all carriers are created equal. You may have an A-rated company. I may not have access to that specific market at A rated. I might have a B rated, but I want to make sure you have the best policy. So I require declarations page. If it's an auto, I want the driver's license. If not, I can find it. I have ways. ⁓ But I always require declarations page, ID card, ⁓ driver's licenses. And I'm going to do my due diligence, and I have a little separate quote sheet that I work line by line to get all my information needed, and I'm gonna sit down and quote it. ⁓ funny how you mention home homes. I run a special unique method with realtors and loan officers. I have never paid a referral finder's fee to any realtor or lender. I tell them, look, I can give you a $25 gift card. You know, for referral or we make an exclusive relationship. I would you treat me as an attorney on retainer. I have an agre ranged agreement with the local agencies around here, especially REMAX. I share an office at Remax. If they send a client to me, I'm gonna have that quote done within forty-five minutes if I'm in office. If I'm not in office, I will make sure I have it to you within three hours and it's gonna be ready to go. And I firmly believe that I literally drop what I'm doing when one of my referral partners contacts me, especially with car salesmen. We all know car salesmen are like us. We live and die by. To sell and the commission. Unlike us, they don't get renewals. So when the car salesman, when I meet them, I give them two business cards. This one has ⁓ comes with a $25 gift card, but it stops at 5 o'clock. Now, this card is my personal cell phone, and I answer at any time. Now let's be honest, they both ring my cell phone. But I've been known to do a quote at 8:30 at night if the call comes through. It's just priority. We can be sitting at the restaurant down the street for family dinner. Call comes through, sweetheart, we gotta go. Let's go play. I gotta get I gotta get back to the house. I have these commitments. And I just believe that if you're gonna do customer service, you gotta be the best. You know, there's as you know, there's hundreds and hundreds of insurance companies and thousands of agents. What sells you? Is it gonna be your brand? I don't think so. I think each and every one of us agents are the brand. I think that we are the reason people buy the policies and I think they buy it from us because what we provide to them. You know, if you make them feel special, you make them feel heard, they're never gonna leave. I had clients that had the twenty percent rate increase, but they stayed because they felt welcomed and heard.

Ben: What are the typical ways in which you go to the carriers to get the quotes?

Steven: Well I run it through Easy Links for personal lines and I'll get my list and because I don't trust Easy Links system I still go manually line by line and I go behind it and I may I double verify, spot check

Ben: Sorry to interrupt. G do you mind just expanding on I think you said it a couple of times now, you don't really trust Easy Links. What is it about Easy Links that you like?

Steven: So the quick rater quotes it, but it's not always accurate. So Easy Links will get me the quotes, it gives me the list of everybody, and it gets their price. What I have learned is that price is gonna be off by $200 to $300, give or take, on most carriers. Sometimes they're spot on, most times they're not. And I've also learned you never tell a client the prices till you run a motor vehicle report. There's just no way you don't know. You know, because little Johnny probably forgot his accident, then tell mom and dad, you know, or whatever the case might be, and it pops up. So I will always run to Easy Links. I will go straight then to the other carrier, and I'm going to run each and every one of those again through that carrier. And I'm gonna make a compile a spreadsheet and I'm gonna put three options, cause I like three three options always. And I say Look, here are my three best recommended options for you. And I email it and I call them. You always got two ways. And I say, keep in mind, this is a clue. I have not run motor vehicle report. I do not stand by any of these prices until I run a motor vehicle report. I don't run a motor vehicle report unless I know you're serious. Because I'm getting charged. I'm honest with my clients. Look, I'm starting over at zero. I have a family of five families, three kids and a wife, a support, a family of five. I can't just waste money willy-nilly. I need to know you are interested and if you're committed, I will do it. Because I never charge an agency fee. I believe that as an agent, I'm here to serve. I'm here to do my job. Quoting and spending my time on you is my job. I am rewarded by earning your business. So I don't charge extra fees. So I want to make sure that you're serious before I lock the prices in.

Ben: How does running a motor vehicle report work?

Steven: I I so I click a button on the carrier, that's all it is. I get charged like twenty cents apiece. But when you do, you know, hundreds of quotes a week or a month, it does start to add up. And like I said, I d I I just I'm very tight at the moment.

Ben: And the ca you you you said you press a button on the carrier side so the carrier d runs the report for you and then tells you. ⁓ and then the Yeah, sorry, go for it.

Steven: Yeah, they handle all that side. Now when it comes to com Go ahead. Now when it comes to commercial insurance quotes, like I said, I will require the declarations pages. And because most carriers will have a co make me fill out a court forms and they're gonna ask anyways, I always require a three-year loss report. So if you're gonna get me to deck page, you better get me to three-year loss report right away to save time.

Ben: That's fascinating, yeah. very cool. Are there any particular carriers that you know you are there any particular carriers that are preferred for you that you would rather see with a quote coming back than others?

Steven: It just depends. So right now where I am, 'cause I'm in a unique place of Texas, you know, I am a hour and fifteen minutes from San Antonio, I'm about an hour and forty five minutes down to the Texas coast. So I have a very wide variety and I've been so I've write clo clients all over the state. You know, I can be out in the desert one day or up in hill the hill country another or East Texas forest, it doesn't matter.

Ben: Yeah.

Steven: But for me along the coastline, if it's a personal, I prefer Safeco. Safeco has a better option, better product, and the wind coverage complements it very well for the for those for the Texas wind and hell. ⁓ San Antonio Market, I on homes, I prefer Sage Share, to be honest with you. ⁓ they give you multiple options, they have great product. They will they're one of the few that I know that will still allow me to do a 1.5% deductible on roofs. Here in Texas, most of your roofs are minimum. ⁓ It's just for me it's I need versatility, you know. out where I live, most homes are custom builds. You're not going to run into a mo a home that's less than $350,000. Some carriers are always going to be cheaper than others. And 90% of my clientele are in a higher rated property protection code. So you're going to pay more for the lack of professional firefighters. So for somebody who's going to work with that, it means the world. Now I you know I know Liberty is getting into a good farm product and I'm excited to test that out because I miss my farm and marketing market r ⁓ niche. But it just takes time.

Ben: Are you dealing with licenses in several states? Can you walk me through how you think about that space?

Steven: And not at the moment. ⁓ so like I said, City Center we're going national, we should be in all fifty states within the next ⁓ by end of next year. Through them, I am eligible to get my own licensing and write in these states. However, like I've stated, I'm very hands-on. So for me to expand my branch to another state, I have to feel comfortable with the person who's gonna represent me in that state. And I'm very, very picky on the way I do things. ⁓ I wanna ⁓ I it's it's a it's like I said it's a brand. We're each a brand. So I want to make sure that, you know, if I hire, you know, little Joey down down in Florida. Florida, is little Joey gonna do the business I do business? Or is Tom in Nevada gonna do business my way? you know, I don't mind if they're not gonna be face to face as I am, but I need to know that they have the same due diligence and the same quality control that I do, because I don't wanna pay an error in a mission claim.

Ben: Of course. And I I think you walk me through the whole spectrum of, you know, the whole workflow from prospecting to then sort of running quotes and even the renewal stuff we touched upon. If you could wave a magic wand to, you know, automate a certain part of your workflow, how what would that look like? What is the part that Steven would really love to see a better tool or a better solution in?

Steven: That that's the that's the fun part, you know. I I pretty much have that most of it. You know, the r the retention center for us does that. For me, when I first started, we had to manually shop each one of those every six months. Now it does it for me. they roll out a new pro

Ben: Retention center is an easy links functionality.

Steven: Easy Leaks product, yes. It's so I have the quote rater, I have the man man policy management portion, and I have a retention rater that helps me with that. ⁓ they have rolled out a software that helps with the accord forms because I just hate accord forms. Like I can't stress it. But before, you know, it's each one you had to manually fill it out. They have a program now for us where I just fill all fill certain boxes in and it'll pre-fill them all for me for all the option the quotes I need, which saves me a lot of time. ⁓ Rumor is they're gonna get an AI powered one where I just gotta upload deck pages in the next couple of years. I'm looking forward to that. ⁓ but I prefer most of the stuff to be done between me and the client in person. You know, I don't mind AI magic wanding back off the support to help me be more efficient. But I like to be the face of the agency. I like to be with the clients. If I had a choice, I would just meet the walk-in clients all day long. I would just happily sit down, visit with them. And you know, most times people just come to talk, you know, you'd be surprised how many elderly widows come by just because they need someone to talk to very lonely. And they're the biggest referral source, you know, they got grandkids, they got family, they got neighbors. And, you know, I just want a cheap, affordable, good quality auto insurance carrier because I've learned auto insurance is your magic ticket. ⁓ Like I always tell producers and agents, what's the biggest door to anybody's home? It's gonna be the garage door. So if I won your heart by saving you money on your car insurance, you better believe I can get in there and sell the rest. one thing I took from my go ahead. I'll say one thing I

Ben: Is ⁓ no, no, I ⁓ yeah, go for it. Sorry.

Steven: One thing I learned and I took from my captive insurance days is the review. ⁓ My old company was very adamant on requiring you to do five to ten face-to-face reviews a week. So when I started this business, I continued that except I created my own separate review form. So I learned a lot of us get complacent and we l we just focus on the renewal and we focus on a new quote, but we don't really know our clients. So with my review form, every evening, I will schedule one or two appointments. I go out to the house, I will go line by line explaining the coverages to them. I will go through to verify all the information on there. If there's loans, take my notes. And I learn in that point is is there any more in houses? ⁓ ⁓ they bought a boat. ⁓ they ⁓ bought RTVs or RVs, whatever. Little Johnny wants to go to AM or Notre Dame or whatever it might be. I'm learning all this other information. You also learn what they have for health insurance. Do they have investments? Where are their investments? Do you have 401ks laying out? And then I like to pivot that into the life insurance. And I'm a very big need seller. I'm not one of those guys that are like, ⁓ you can buy a million for whatever. I don't do that. I have a separate form I filled out and I basically start it. And I go in and I say, okay, final expenses, and I get I turn my review form out, I let the clients fill it out. And I'll write their names on top of each line and say, okay, first is final expense. What do you what does a funeral usually run? Nobody ever knows because most people have not had to deal with that. And here in Texas, if you want a traditional funeral, that's about $25,000. So I say, okay, we'll start with $25,000 or let's bump it to $50,000 because there's always more expenses. And we'll go through personal debt, ⁓ mortgage, college for kiddos, and readjustment income. And I'll come to a need, and then I would pivot off of that into a what I what I've coined the ⁓ term spent and gone. Spent and gone is I basically do a 20-year presentation of what the term caught truly costs the whole life minus cash value, and I'll pivot to a implied close of option A or B, and I will close the life app. ⁓ With that style of review and life presentation, I have about maybe a 70%, 80% close ratio. I've never come home empty-handed on a review. There's always some sell. And ⁓ by the way, you got kiddos, you know, God forbid, you know, kids more likely aren't going to pass away until they're older, but life happens, accidents happen, health happens. A child can become type one diabetic, or they become epileptic, or they may have seizures, or they may be injured in a car accident that can affect their future insurability. Why not do something to protect their future insurbility? And Parents will dig deep to guarantee that insurability. ⁓ I had one parent bought a million dollar whole life once just for little Emily because family had ⁓ medical history in the past and they wanted to guarantee that their daughter could have a policy. It's I I just like I said, the review is a missed opportunity.

Ben: That's so interesting. Are these the daughter having a million dollar policy, does that mean that if the daughter died, then is is that the type of t life insurance

Steven: So so in this case it was a million dollar whole life, so if a daughter were to pass away after ⁓ of course have to do medical underwriting, even while it's being underwriting, they would have paid it. ⁓ but if the daughter would have passed away any given time from day one or to the day can policies terminated or she passes, it's paid out. So with whole life I tell everybody three things will happen. You live till 120, they paid a million dollars. You die, we paid a million dollars. You quit, you take whatever cash value is. And if there's no get ⁓ if you've not made money on your investment, that's tax-free money to you. ⁓ I also like to point out the living benefits. You know, you could annuitize. it at some point. You know, you can borrow against it. Now it's a highly owned interest rate, but it is an opportunity. a very large amount of business owners will buy life insurance just for the buy a key sell a key man or buy-sell agreements or just for the fact that they can have an annuitized retirement at some point.

Ben: Does the appointment process and life insurance work in the same way as with P and C?

Steven: Excuse me?

Ben: Does the appointment process work in the same way as with P and C in the life insurance space?

Steven: It's it's yeah, I I actually fill it out when I go to ⁓ it that my my review is about an hour and a half appointment 'cause I can knock it a review out in thirty minutes. Live I'll do my presentation in ten, fifteen. I'm gonna sit there and fill the app out while I'm there with them. So it takes a little more time. And we go line by line, we make sure it's correct. And I'm building rapport the whole time. By the time I'm leaving, you know, they they're inviting me to go eat dinner with them afterwards and it's by being face to face and doing it that way, you has such a better retention schedule. ⁓ back in my captive days a lot of guys w like to do the e signs where they would fill it out, email it over, they click it and they got credit. But they never had the great retention. You know When I was running my four point five million dollar book of business, I carried a ninety percent retention rate across life and P and C. And that was because I do so much service work on the front end or the back end. ⁓ I listened to one of your previous podcasts and the gentleman was talking about doing quotes on Christmas Eve. I do the same thing. My wife will tell you I don't care where we're at. My computer goes at me on vacation, it goes everywhere. It's my briefcase or my computer doesn't matter. I can be at Disney World and I'm gonna go find a hot spot to do the quote because my clients do come first to me.

Ben: ⁓ is there a particular t profile of customer where it'll be hard for you to place their insurance? And how do you deal with it situations like that when they arise?

Steven: I if it was my previous captive days, yes, that would have been a problem. Today, n it's not a problem. ⁓ you know, I have my preferred carriers, my progressive, my geico, my liberty, my mercury, you s you name it, you say it. But I have access to a company out of Georgia, ⁓ Assurance America, you may have heard of ⁓ their their founder or co-founder or founder was ⁓ Georgia Center ⁓ Bud Stombach. His company is designed to work with people with less than desirable auto history or, you know, credit scores or whatever have you. So they don't even run credit checks on they'll run ⁓ VR but they don't check your credit, they don't care. Those type of individuals I like to place them there. Now home insurance is a little different because there I've seen some very questionable homes. one story this was when I was still at my old captive company in twenty seventeen. I went out to Santone to an older, rougher neighborhood in town to write the house. They wanted they needed insurance. I get there, I open a door, and there's a hole. There's a six foot by five foot hole in the middle of the Pierre Beam floor. And you can see the dirt underneath. And she's like, ⁓ watch your step. We had a water leak here a few years ago. And I looked at her and I was like, Yeah, ma'am, there's no way I'm gonna be able to do this. Well, do you think you can lie? No, ma'am, I will not lie for you and lose my licensing. There's no way in the world. I cannot do this. I will have to pass. ⁓ or my favorite. They got the mean dog. You know, I've been to one house, dog's chained in the front yard, he's barking. ⁓ does your dog bite? ⁓ not too much. We're done. Not even gonna get out of truck. I'm sorry. This is we're not a fit. And I explain to my clients, look, you know, I'm not gonna cut corners. I'm gonna give you adequate limits. You know, you might say you want state minimums. I don't do state minimums. This is what we're gonna do. We're gonna look at your assets, and we're gonna base it off of that. And guess what? We're gonna do the review. There's no, hey, write this policy. I'm I'll see you in six months. No, we're gonna sit down, we're gonna get to know each other. I know I'm not a fit for everybody. I know the way I do business is not a fit for everybody. But if we're going to do business, I need you to trust me as much as I'm gonna trust you. Because I'm representing multiple brands, multiple companies. I'm not gonna write my name on a bad investment. You know, if you're a bad driver, you have issues, you've had 10 wrecks, they have a 2,000% loss ratio. I don't want you. And I have passed on some clients. ⁓ you know, I had one gentleman who used to work for me, and I don't know what the deal was, but we had this one little old lady who kept, you know, harassing them and stalking them and just obsessed with them. And I was like, man, I'm gonna have to ask you to leave the agency. I'm not, I can't be your agent no more. This is getting borderline scary. I'm not gonna I can't improve of this. And we went our separate ways.

Ben: What c can you walk me through the dog example? What was the worry that you had when you saw this aggressive

Steven: ⁓ when I asked her if the dog bit and she says not so much. So this was a this

Ben: And that's and that's a liability for pet insurance, or was it a you know a general liability concern for home insurance?

Steven: Well it's a liability for home insurance. ⁓ like I said I'm very people f focused. I I got I'm passionate, I don't know if you can tell. But when I get and this was another rougher neighborhood in town as well that I got to, and this dog, you know, is a big dog and it's already on a vicious breed list, you know, German Shepherd, and it's foaming out the mouth, barking on that little chain and that steel post that's holding is bent already, you know. And I'm like, hey, dog bite? No, not too much. We're done.

Ben: Yeah.

Steven: I've actually been bit twice now on appointments. So I'm very picky on that. I've I used to go to all my appointments in dress shoes and you know dress slacks and I went to one, it was a country house. Lady had a blue healer. Dogs at the door jumping, barking, and I'm like, hey, ⁓ the spider bite. No, I'll go put them up for you. Well, she didn't put them up. She just took them in a backyard and closed the gate, didn't latch it, and said, stay. I come out, we finished the paperwork to do the house, and I'm going around because at that carrier I had to take the photos myself for the home inspection.

Ben: yeah.

Steven: And I come around the side and here comes that dog, and next thing it's latched on the back of my ankle, and I'm I can feel the blood pouring out of my leg and that dog's just tearing at me. And I'm sitting here hollering, trying to beat him off with my briefcase. And she gets mad at me for hitting her dog, and I'm like, lady, it you know, I just got hurt. And I said, you know what? I said, I'm not gonna call the law, I'm not even gonna send you a medical bill. I'm just not writing your business. And I tore the con application, gave her her check back and said, We're not a fit. This is a liability risk. And it's just I take it s I take my job serious. I'm not gonna write business that I know is going to be flawed. I I believe ⁓ insurance is a pool of experience and I believe a rising tide will raise or lower all ships. So we all have that you know, obligation to the industry and the profession as a whole to look out for everybody else. I really do believe in a mindset of abundance. So I may not be a fit, but my competitor down the street who's another independent might. And I'm gonna say, look, your risk, I can't do it. They have a market, they can help you. Let me give you to them. They can we do that vice versa. Believe it or not, I get probably 10 quotes a week from competitor or agents in the area, because like, hey, we can't place do you want ⁓ Sure. Or if I got something I know they may have a carrier who's gonna be not a preferred carrier, but they're cheap and this person is one of those that I not gonna meet my criteria. I'm gonna be like, hey, Miss Holly or Miss Kelly down the street can help you. Here's our personal number. I'll call them, let them know you'll be reaching out. ⁓ if there's anything else I can do for you or your family, please let me know in the future. ⁓ my favorite go-to at the end of any conversation or review is look, ⁓ if you found what I've done with you today was ⁓ valuable, if I brought cer ⁓ great service to you, the biggest compliment is tell somebody about me and refer ⁓ and share my name. Cause let's be honest, I am never too busy to help people who are important to you. ⁓ you know, if you hand them a piece of paper and you ask them, can you give me three names, four names, they never can. But if I give them extra cards and say, hey, I'm never too busy to help the ones you care and love, they're gonna tell people about you.

Ben: For sure. If you're looking into the future, Steven, what would success look like for the city centre branch that you're running in the next five years?

Steven: For me, honestly, to survive. Like I said, I started at zero. So, you know, I went for making well over six figures with my four point five million dollar book, as you can imagine, and I went to zero. So I'm basically right now just trying to survive. I'm I'm learning as I go as I go. I'm growing. ⁓ for me, I want to hit a million dollar book of business by the end of next year. That's my goal. And I want to expand that every two to three years. I would like to have four to five agents under me. I would like to potentially work more with the newer branches coming on with City Centers. Like I said, I've got years in the business. I wanna help. You know, I the whole point of me, like I started like I mentioned I'm an author. I started writing because I wanted to help other agents. When I left my captive company, I felt that I was no longer useful. It said I was burnt out, I was no longer needed. That really hits you hard. And it left, you know, a hurt and hole in my heart feeling that I needed had something to prove. I don't want people to feel that way. And like you, you're trying to help other people with your podcast. I get emotional on this. But I do this because I want others to not feel the way I did. And if I can teach the next generation, that's what I want to do. I'm just, you know, I'm very passionate about the industry. I think I have so much to hold. I hope I one day have a large business. And I'd like to think that one day I'll be the top competitor in my region. But it's it's a s it's a steady process. You know, no insurance is not a get rich quick industry. I don't care what anybody tells you. Nobody makes it big their first year unless they're doing something shady. Or they got a war chest. It's just a slow, steady march uphill and maybe one day I'll have a large book myself.

Ben: Is there anything looking back at you know the the decade you've already spent in insurance ⁓ that you learnt that you wish you would have known earlier?

Steven: Yes. I wish I would have left the Captain World a lot sooner. I I was a company man all the way. Like I said, I lived and bl bled for that logo. When I started, I thought I was gonna spend my life there. I am loyal to a default. And to and it it really, you know, it shows, you know, it my family can tell you it affected my family. I started my day early. I got home at nine thirty every night. I lived and bled for that company. And there was a point after COVID till from 2020 to when I left in twenty-four when I was struggling because I couldn't read to the adapt to this new world of not so face to face. And you know, they would joke, hey, you're so upset and you're miserable and you're angry, you're burnt out. And I said, Yeah, well I'm still smiling. And I go, What's your secret? I was Well, you just learn to live with the stress and you learn to live with the the the hustle culture. Now I know there's a better way. There's no reason you have to kill yourself for a company who's just gonna throw you away the minute you are no longer a cog that fits in the machine. And I tell everybody who's still I know in the captive for my old company, I like, there's a better way. Get out of the golden cage. That money is a trap. You can make it and do so much more. You can help more people do an independent route. As an independent now There's no one telling me I can't go help this client. Before, hey, you can't talk to them because they belong to another agency, two counties over. Well, why is he in my office asking for my help if they can't do it? And now it's you come to my office, I can help you. You know, it's to me it's a personal mission. I just I want to help people.

Ben: Yeah. Amazing. I'm gonna read us out and then I'll end the recording. ⁓ I'd love to stay on the line to make sure that things upload and ⁓ and also because I have a couple of more thoughts. but Stephen, thank you so much for joining the podcast.

Steven: I appreciate you.